Russian Cruiser Tech Tree

Istvan56
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Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:41 pm
Location: Nampa, Idaho

Russian Cruiser Tech Tree

Postby Istvan56 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 3:01 pm

After looking at the often contradictory information that the semi-official "What we know about Ships: Updated 25/06/2015" http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/1697-what-we-know-about-ships-updated-25062015/ thread by mr3awsome on the WoWs NA server I went looking for alternative sources and ideas for a Russian Cruiser Tech Tree. I found this to be a hot topic on the RU forum, naturally, with many good ideas from Russian players Bambarabum, 753, Jingle, TwilightCat and others. And so, with much speculation and wild opinion, here we go:

Tier I
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mr3awsome 's list has the aviso Almaz (Diamond) which was an unprotected cruiser. Her armament seriously sucks so no way should she be placed up against any other nation's starter cruiser. Almaz had the distinction of being the only survivor of the Battle of Tsushima Strait to make it to Vladivostock.

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753 recommends the Boyarin, a protected cruiser sunk during the Siege of Port Arthur after striking mines laid by an inexperienced minelayer that also managed to sink itself while laying the minefield. I would consider this ship more of a Tier II premium candidate as she only has six 4.7" (120mm) canet guns as her main armament and 8 47mm plus 4 37mm secondaries/AA guns.

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Bambarabum recommends the Khasan-class (Project 1190) monitors for starter ships. While built to be river monitors they were sea-going ships. Monitors are slow but have better armament than most of their opponents. This is my pick for the Tier I starter ship as she is from the same time period as the other nations' starter ships.
Main Armament: 3x2 - 130mm
Secondary/AA Armament: 2x2 - 76mm, 3x2 - 45mm, 5x2 - 12.7mm
Armor: Belt 75mm
Speed: 15.5 knots

Tier II
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mr3awsome 's list has two candidates but we are only going to look at the first. The first is the Zhemchug (Pearl) Protected Cruiser, a Russian built Novik cruiser. This drawing is of her sister-ship and lead of the class, the Izumrud. This is a popular choice for Tier II among the Russian players. The Zhemchug survived the Russo-Japanese War only to be sunk while in port by the famous SMS Emden during WW-I.
Type: Protected cruiser
Displacement: 3,103 long tons (3,153 t)
Length: 111 m (364 ft)
Beam: 12.2 m (40 ft)
Draught: 5 m (16 ft)
Propulsion: 3 shafts, triple expansion steam engines
16 Yarrow coal-fired boilers
17,000 hp (13,000 kW)
510 tons coal
Speed: 24 kn (44 km/h)
Range: 3,790 nmi (7,020 km)
Complement: 350
Armament: • 6 × 120 mm (4.7 in) guns
• 6 × 47 mm (1.9 in) guns
• 2 × 37 mm (1.5 in) guns
• 3 × 460 mm (18 in) torpedo tubes

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The other choice is the ill-fated Boyarin formerly a candidate for Tier I. It had the distinction of being Danish built.
Type: Protected cruiser
Displacement: 3,200 long tons (3,251 t)
Length: 105.2 m (345 ft)
Beam: 12.5 m (41 ft)
Draught: 4.88 m (16 ft)
Propulsion: 2 shaft reciprocating vertical triple-expansion steam engines
16 Belleville coal-fired boilers
8,600 kW (11,500 hp)
Speed: 22 knots (25 mph; 41 km/h)
Endurance: 3000 nm
Complement: 16 officers + 315 cew
Armament: • 6 120 mm (4.7 in) Canet guns
• 8 Hotchkiss rapid fire 47 mm (1.9 in) guns
• 4 37 mm (1.5 in) Hotchkiss guns
• 2 Maxim machine guns
5 381 mm (15 in) torpedo tubes
Armour: Krupp armour; deck: 50 mm (2.0 in)
conning tower: 76 mm (3 in)

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Of course we know the Diana is in the game now as a Tier II premium cruiser.

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Players TwilightCat and 753 both had the brilliant idea of adding the Rurik Armored Cruiser to the game and I think it would be a great counter to the Mikasa as a Tier II premium ship. This is not the first Rurik, sunk during the Battle of Ulsan but the Rurik II built by Vickers in 1906. She was the flagship of the Baltic Fleet in WW-I and saw a lot of action against the Germans. (Note: 753 actually recommended it as a Tier III premium but thought of the Mikasa at Tier II so moved it down a tier.)
Type: Armored Cruiser
Displacement: 15,170 tons
Length: 529 ft (161 m)[1]
Beam: 75 ft (22.9 m)
Draught: 26 ft (7.9 m)
Propulsion: 2 shaft Vertical triple expansion steam engines, 28 Bellville coal-fired boilers 20,675 hp (15,417 kW)
Speed: 21 knots (39 km/h)
Endurance: 1,920 tons coal
Complement: 899 officers and crewmen
Armament:
4 x 10 in (250 mm) guns (2 x 2)
8 × 8 in (200 mm) guns (4 x 2)
20 x 4.7 in (120 mm) (20 x 1)
4 x 1.9 in (47 mm) guns,
2 × 18 in (457 mm) torpedo tubes
Armour: Krupp armour
Belt: 6 in (150 mm) max
Turrets 8–7 in (200–180 mm)
Barbettes: 8–6 in (200–150 mm)
Deck: 1.5 in (38 mm)
Casemates: 3 in (76 mm)
Conning tower: 8 in (200 mm)


Tier III
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The difficulty with Tier III is that there are so many worthy candidates. mr3awsome 's list has the Bogatyr-class Protected cruiser as a Tier II but I feel very strongly this should be the choice for the Tier III Russian cruiser. It has a unique mix of turreted and casemented 152mm (6") guns similar to an armored cruiser but uniform in gun size so she fits well into the game. She is a worthy foe to the St. Louis.
Class and type: Bogatyr-class protected cruiser
Displacement: 5910 tons full load
Length: 134 m (439.6 ft)
Beam: 16.6 m (54.5 ft)
Draught: 6.29 m (20.6 ft)
Installed power: 23,000 hp
Propulsion: 2 shaft Triple expansion steam engines (VTE), 16 Normand-Sigaudy boilers - 19,500 hp
Speed: 23 knots (43 km/h)
Range: 3,000 nautical miles (6,000 km) at 12 knots (22 km/h)
Complement: 581 officers and crewmen
Armament:
4 - 152 mm (6 in)/L45 Canet guns in turrets
8 - 152 mm (6 in)/L45 Canet guns in casemates
12 - 75-millimetre (3 in)/L50 Canet guns
8 - 47-millimetre (2 in) /L43 Canet guns
2 – 37-millimetre (1 in)/L23 Hotchkiss machine guns
4 - 388-millimetre (15 in) torpedo tubes
Armour:
Sloping deck: 35–70 mm (1–3 in)
Conning tower: 140-millimetre (6 in)

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The other choice for Tier III is the Varyag Protected cruiser, famous for being her crew's refusal to surrender to the Japanese in the Battle of Chemulpo Bay, sinking her instead, then being raised by the Japanese, returned to the Russians and finally for being US built.
Type: Protected cruiser
Displacement: 6,500 long tons (6,604 t)
Length: 129.6 m (425 ft 2 in) w/l
Beam: 15.8 m (51 ft 10 in)
Draught: 6.3 m (20 ft 8 in)
Propulsion: 2-shaft Vertical triple expansion steam engines
30 Niclausse water-tube boilers
20,000 ihp (15,000 kW)
Speed: 23 knots (26 mph; 43 km/h)
Complement: 570
Armament: 12 × 1 - 152 mm (6 in) guns
12 × 1 - 75 mm (3.0 in) guns
8 × 1 - 47 mm (1.9 in) guns
2 × 1 - 37 mm (1.5 in) guns
6 × 1 - 381 mm (15.0 in) submerged torpedo tubes

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Then of course we have the Aurora premium cruiser in game already.


I'm going to stop for now and add the rest of my choices in my next post. To recap, my picks are Tier I - Khasan; Tier II - Zhemchug ; Tier III - Bogatyr with strong support for Rurik II to be added as a Tier II premium counter to Mikasa.
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Istvan56
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Posts: 142
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Re: Russian Cruiser Tech Tree

Postby Istvan56 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 8:21 pm

Now for the Interwar Period and Soviet innovation. Since the USSR was not a signatory to either the Washington Naval Treaty or the Treaty of London the Rodina did not have to abide by the limits set forth by either document. Hence Soviet naval designers started making cruisers that didn't fit within the norms other navies followed. There were no light cruisers or heavy cruisers by treaty standards, there were ships that seemed to be neither fish nor fowl, their main armaments and layouts unique to the Soviet Navy. For game classifications by tech tree cruisers which have 155mm (6.1") guns or less will be classified light cruisers (CL) and those with larger than 155mm will be classified heavy cruisers (CA).

Tier IV

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Profintern in 1929
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Krasnyi Krym (Red Crimea) in 1941 with upgraded AA suite
My pick for the Tier IV light cruiser is the Krasnyi Krym (Red Crimea)-ex-Profintern ex-Svetlana was laid down as the lead vessel of a class of light cruisers to serve both as fleet scouts and destroyer leaders. But due to both WW-I and the Russian Revolution the ship was not completed until 1926. Krasnyi Krym, as fitting her name, served in the Black Sea Fleet and survived WW-II seeing much action against the Axis Forces earning Guard status in 1942. Post-war she was reclassified as a training ship, then an experimental ship and finally as a floating barracks before being broken up for scrap in 1959.
Class and type: Svetlana-class light cruiser
Displacement: 6,839 tonnes (6,731 long tons; 7,539 short tons) (standard)
7,999 tonnes (7,873 long tons; 8,817 short tons) (full load)
Length: 158.4 m (519 ft 8 in)
Beam: 15.35 m (50 ft 4 in)
Draught: 6.65 m (21 ft 10 in)
Installed power: 50,000 shp (37,000 kW)
Propulsion: 4 shafts, Curtis-AEG geared steam turbines
13 Yarrow water-tube boilers
Speed: 29 knots (54 km/h; 33 mph)
Range: 3,350 nmi (6,200 km; 3,860 mi) at 14 knots (26 km/h; 16 mph)
Complement: 850
Armament: 15 × 1 - 130 mm (5.1 in)/55 B7 Pattern 1913 guns
9 × 1 - 76 mm (3.0 in) AA guns
2 × 3 - 450 mm (18 in) torpedo tubes
100 mines
Armor: Upper and lower armored decks: 20 mm (0.79 in) each
Gun shields: 25 mm (0.98 in)
Lower armor belt: 76 mm (3.0 in)
Upper armor belt: 25 mm (0.98 in)
Conning tower: 76 mm (3.0 in)

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I think that the Komintern (Communist International) – ex- Pamiat' Merkuria (Memory of Mercury), a Bogatyr-class Protected cruiser belongs at Tier IV as a premium ship. She started out her career as an Imperial Navy ship like her sister the Tier III Bogatyr but was extensively rebuilt in the 1920's using the former's parts and rearmed by the Soviet Navy giving her new life. Hence moving the Komintern up a tier as a light cruiser. She was used as a training cruiser during the Interwar Period and then was reclassified as a minesweeper at the start of the Great Patriotic War. She was sunk in combat by the Luftwaffe in 1942.
Type: Light cruiser
Displacement: 6,340 long tons (6,440 t)
Length: 134.9 m (442 ft 7 in)
Beam: 16.4 m (53 ft 10 in)
Draft: 6.8 m (22 ft 4 in)
Installed power: 19,500 shp (14,500 kW)
Propulsion: 2 shafts
2 vertical triple-expansion steam engines
16 Belleville boilers
Speed: 23 knots (43 km/h; 26 mph)
Endurance: 2,100 nmi (3,900 km; 2,400 mi) at 12 knots (22 km/h; 14 mph)
Complement: 730
Armament: 14 × 1 – 130 mm (5.1 in) guns
2 × 1 – 75 mm (3.0 in) anti-aircraft guns
2 × 3 – 457 mm (18.0 in) torpedo tubes
Armor: deck: 76 mm (3.0 in)
Casemates: 76 mm (3.0 in)
Conning tower: 152 mm (6.0 in)




Tier V
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Chervona Ukraina in 1939 courtesy http://www.the-blueprints.com
Chervona Ukraina (Red Ukraine) – ex- Admiral Nakhimov Light Cruiser was built with single gun mounts sporting the proven 130mm (5.1") 55 caliber 57 pattern 1913 guns. She was modernized in the 1930's receiving new boilers, newer pattern 130mm guns and upgraded torpedo armament, the old 18" (457mm) replaced by 21" (533mm) torpedoes. The Chervona Ukraina served with her half-sister, Krasnyi Kavkaz, in the Black Sea laying minefields, transporting troops and shelling Axis ground forces. She was sunk in action by the Luftwaffe on 13 November 1941.
Class and type: Admiral Nakhimov-class light cruiser
Displacement: 8,400 tonnes (8,300 long tons; 9,300 short tons)
Length: 166.7 m (546 ft 11.0 in)
Beam: 15.7 m (51 ft 6.1 in)
Draught: 6.2 m (20 ft 4 in)
Installed power: 55,000 shp (41,000 kW)
Propulsion: 4 shafts, 4 Steam turbines
14 Yarrow boilers
Speed: 29.5 knots (54.6 km/h; 33.9 mph)
Range: 3,700 nmi (6,900 km; 4,300 mi) at 14 knots (26 km/h; 16 mph)
Complement: 852
Armament: 15 × 1 – 130 mm (5.1 in)/55 B7 Pattern 1913 guns (2 fore, 1 amidship, 2 aft, 10 in casements), later upgraded to 130 mm/50 B13 Pattern 1936 guns
3 × 2 – 100 mm (3.9 in) Minizini AA guns
4 × 1 – 45 mm (1.8 in) 21-K AA guns
7 × 1 – 12.7 mm (0.50 in) machine guns
2 × 3 – 457 mm (18.0 in) torpedo tubes later upgraded to 2 × 3 - 533 mm (21.0 in) torpedo tubes
60–100 mines
Armour: Upper and lower armoured decks: 20 mm (0.79 in) each
Gun shields: 25 mm (0.98 in)
Lower armour belt: 76 mm (3.0 in)
Upper armour belt: 25 mm (0.98 in)
Conning tower: 76 mm (3.0 in)

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Krasnyi Kavkaz (Red Caucaus) - "Heavy Cruiser" the "half-sister" to the Chervona Ukraina is the second of two Admiral Nakhimov-class cruisers. This is one of those special ships that defies the rules. Like the IJN Furataka she sports her main guns in single turrets, though she only has four 180mm instead of the "Furry Taco's" six 203mm guns. The Soviet Navy tried to mount standard 200mm heavy cruiser guns in four twin turrets but the hull was too small to bear the weight and size. The Navy then tried to put 180mm (7.1") 57-caliber B-1-K in three twin turrets but again, the hull was too unstable to handle them. Finally they had to settle for four single turrets with the older 180mm MK-1-180 guns in them.
Class and type: Admiral Nakhimov-class cruiser
Displacement: 7,560 metric tons (7,440 long tons; 8,330 short tons) (standard)
9,030 metric tons (8,890 long tons; 9,950 short tons) (full load)
Length: 159.5 m (523 ft 4 in)
Beam: 15.7 m (51 ft 6 in)
Draught: 6.6 m (21 ft 8 in)
Propulsion: 4 shafts, Brown-Boveri geared turbines
10 Yarrow oil-fired boilers
55,000 shp (41,000 kW)
Speed: 29 knots (33 mph; 54 km/h)
Range: 3,500 nmi (6,480 km) at 15 knots (28 km/h)
Complement: 878
Armament: 4 × 1 - 180 mm cal 57 guns
4 × 2 - 100 mm cal 56 AA guns
2 × 1 - 76 mm AA guns
4 × 1 - 45 mm AA guns
4 × 1 - 12.7 mm (0.50 in) AA machine guns
4 × 3 - 533 mm (21.0 in) torpedo tubes
60–120 mines
Armour: Upper and lower armoured decks: 20 mm (0.79 in) each
Turrets: 76 mm (3.0 in)
Lower armour belt: 76 mm (3.0 in)
Upper armour belt: 25 mm (0.98 in)
Conning tower: 76 mm (3.0 in)
Aircraft carried: 2 × KOR-1 seaplanes
Aviation facilities: 1 catapult

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And everyone knows about the Murmansk, the USS Milwaukee on lend lease to the USSR. As a Tier V Premium she is a great ship.
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Istvan56
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Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:41 pm
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Re: Russian Cruiser Tech Tree

Postby Istvan56 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 10:22 pm

Tier VI
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Project 26 Kirov in 1939 with a Heinkel K-12 catapult, these were later replaced by Russian ZK-1 catapult on the Project 26bis
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Italian light cruiser Riamondo Montecuccoli that the Kirov class cruisers were based off of

At Tier VI I'm for one large 6 ship "heavy cruiser" class that saw improvements over time, the Project 26 Kirov-class, the Project 26bis Maxim Gorky subclass and the Project 26bis2 Kaganovich subclass. Note that the Soviet Navy classified them as Legkiy kreiser (KRL) meaning light cruisers but as I mentioned previously, with the game drawing the line at 155mm (6.1") guns as the maximum for light cruiser status I put these in the "heavy cruiser" line. All the Project 26 ships were based off of the Italian Raimondo Montecuccoli-class light cruisers but made larger to house the Duca d'Aosta-class cruiser machinery and further strengthened to handle the rougher Arctic and Pacific Oceans that the Soviet Navy patrols. After each pair was completed the next pair was modified and improved, usually also make larger so the statics are different for each of the subclasses. Furthermore, the original ships saw improvements over the course of their careers.


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Project 26 Kirov in 1940 after her first refit adding more AA guns
As the prototype for the class the Kirov used foreign engines and had numerous problems with her turrets, gun blast, etc. that were dealt with on each successive ship subclass. The Voroshilov, while laid down first, was completed second and used more reliable Soviet engines.
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Project 26 Voroshilov in 1942-1943 after repairs due to combat damage

Class and type: Kirov-class cruiser
Displacement: 7,890 tonnes (7,765 long tons) (standard)
9,436 tonnes (9,287 long tons) (full load)
Length: 191.3 m (627 ft 7 in)
Beam: 17.66 m (57 ft 11 in)
Draught: 6.15 m (20 ft 2 in) (full load)
Installed power: 113,500 shp (84,600 kW)
Propulsion: 2 shafts, TB-7 geared turbines
6 Yarrow-Normand oil-fired boilers
Speed: Kirov 35.94 knots (66.56 km/h; 41.36 mph) (on trials) Voroshilov 36.72 knots (68.01 km/h; 42.26 mph) (on trials)
Endurance: 3,750 nmi (6,940 km; 4,320 mi) at 18 knots (33 km/h; 21 mph)
Complement: 872
Sensors and
processing systems: Arktur hydrophone
Armament: 3 × 3 - 180 mm (7.1 in) B-1-P guns
6 × 1 - 100 mm (3.9 in) B-34 dual-purpose guns
6 × 1 - 45-millimeter (1.8 in) 21-K AA gun
4 × 1 - 12.7-millimeter (0.50 in) AA machine guns
2 × 3 - 533-millimeter (21.0 in) torpedo tubes
96–164 mines
50 depth charges
Armor: Waterline belt: 50 mm (2.0 in)
Deck: 50 mm (2.0 in) each
Turrets: 50 mm (2.0 in)
Barbettes: 50 mm (2.0 in)
Conning tower: 150 mm (5.9 in)
Aircraft carried: 2 × KOR-1 seaplanes
Aviation facilities: 1 Heinkel K-12 catapult

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Project 26bis Maxim Gorky subclass in 1941, drawing courtesy of http://www.the-blueprints.com
Class and type: Kirov-class cruiser
Displacement: 8,177 tonnes (8,048 long tons) (standard)
9,728 tonnes (9,574 long tons) (full load)
Length: 191.4 m (627 ft 11 in)
Beam: 17.66 m (57 ft 11 in)
Draught: 6.3 m (20 ft 8 in) (full load)
Installed power: 129,750 shp (96,750 kW)
Propulsion: 2 shafts, TB-7 geared steam turbines
6 Yarrow-Normand oil-fired boilers
Speed: 36.72 knots (68.01 km/h; 42.26 mph) (on trials)
Endurance: 4,220 nmi (7,820 km; 4,860 mi) at 18 knots (33 km/h; 21 mph)
Complement: 963
Sensors and
processing systems: Arktur hydrophone
Armament: 3 × 3 - 180 mm (7.1 in) B-1-P guns
6 × 1 - 100 mm (3.9 in) B-34 dual-purpose guns
9 × 1 - 45-millimeter (1.8 in) 21-K AA gun
4 × 1 - 12.7-millimeter (0.50 in) AA machine guns
2 × 3 - 533-millimeter (21.0 in) torpedo tubes
96–150 mines
50 depth charges
Armor: Waterline belt: 70 mm (2.8 in)
Deck: 50 mm (2.0 in) each
Turrets: 70 mm (2.8 in)
Barbettes: 70 mm (2.8 in)
Conning tower: 150 mm (5.9 in)
Aircraft carried: 2 × KOR-1 seaplanes
Aviation facilities: 1 ZK-1 catapult

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Project 26bis2 Kaganovich subclass cruiser post-war with her catapult removed. Drawing courtesy of http://www.the-blueprints.com
Class and type: Kirov-class cruiser
Displacement: 8,400 tonnes (8,267 long tons) (standard)
10,040 tonnes (9,881 long tons) (full load)
Length: 191.2 m (627 ft 4 in)
Beam: 17.66 m (57 ft 11 in)
Draught: 6.3 m (20 ft 8 in) (full load)
Installed power: 126,900 shp (94,600 kW)
Propulsion: 2 shafts, TB-7 geared turbines
6 Yarrow-Normand oil-fired boilers
Speed: 36 knots (67 km/h; 41 mph) (on trials)
Endurance: 5,590 nmi (10,350 km; 6,430 mi) at 17 knots (31 km/h; 20 mph)
Complement: 812
Sensors and
processing systems: ASDIC-132 and Mars-72 sonars
Armament: 3 × 3 - 180 mm (7.1 in) B-1-P guns
8 × 1 - 85 mm (3.3 in) 90-K dual-purpose guns
6 × 1 - 45 mm (1.8 in) 21-K AA guns
10 × 1 - 37 mm (1.5 in) 70-K
6 × 1 - 12.7 mm (0.50 in) DShK AA machine guns
2 × 3 - 533 mm (21.0 in) torpedo tubes
100–106 mines
50 depth charges
Armour: Waterline belt: 70 mm (2.8 in)
Deck: 50 mm (2.0 in) each
Turrets: 70 mm (2.8 in)
Barbettes: 70 mm (2.8 in)
Conning tower: 150 mm (5.9 in)
Aircraft carried: 2 × KOR-2 seaplanes (removed post-war)
Aviation facilities: 1 ZK-2b catapult (later removed)

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Molotov Heavy Cruiser in 1942 before the improved ZK1-A catapult was installed with its Supermarine Spitfire fighter and the Mars-1 fire control radar
As a Tier VI premium I would like to see the Molotov from the Project 26bis subclass. The Molotov saw heavy combat and after having her stern blown off by a He-111 torpedo bomber she was extensively rebuilt using parts from four other ships including a submarine. Molotov was also unique in having a ship-borne fighter on her instead of a spotting plane. In 1943 the Molotov, along with all other capital ships, was withdrawn from action on Stalin's orders due to the heavy loss of 3 Soviet destroyers to the Luftwaffe on 6 October 1943. This allowed the Soviet Navy to experiment with her and they upgraded her twice, first adding the improved ZK1-A catapult and then in 1944 giving her a MARS-1 fire direction control radar. This upgraded 1944 version with the Supermarine Spitfire is the version I would like to see in game as a premium.

Post-war Foreign Minister Molotov fell out of favor and the ship was renamed the Slava (Glory). Her catapult and fighters were removed in 1947 and she was extensively modernized with the latest radar and sonar suites at tremendous cost to the Soviet Navy. She became a training cruiser and served until 1972 when she was scrapped.

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For the Tier VI light cruiser I propose the Kerch, the ex-Emanuele Filiberto Duca d'Aosta of the Regia Marina given to the USSR as war reparations. She was transferred to the Soviet Navy in March, 1949 first as the Z15, then renamed briefly as the Stalingrad before they settled on naming her the Kerch. She served dutifully in the Black Sea Fleet until 1959 when she was stricken from the Navy List. She was scrapped in 1960.
Class and type: Condottieri-class cruiser
Displacement: 8,450 t (8,317 long tons) standard
10,539 t (10,373 long tons) full load
Length: 186.9 m (613 ft 2 in)
Beam: 17.5 m (57 ft 5 in)
Draught: 6.1 m (20 ft 0 in)
Propulsion: 2 shaft Belluzzo/Parsons geared turbines
6 Yarrow boilers
110,000 hp (82,027 kW)
Speed: 36.5 knots (42.0 mph; 67.6 km/h)
Range: 3,900 nmi (7,200 km) at 14 kn (16 mph; 26 km/h)
Complement: 578
Armament: • 8 × 152 mm (6 in) guns (4×2)
• 6 × 100 mm (3.9 in) guns (3×2)
• 8 × 37 mm guns (4×2)
• 12 × 13.2 mm guns (4×2)
Armour: Deck: 35 mm (1.4 in)
Main belt: 70 mm (2.8 in)
Turrets: 90 mm (3.5 in)
Conning tower: 100 mm (3.9 in)
Aircraft carried: 2 or 3 KOR-2 floatplanes
Aviation facilities: 1 catapult
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Istvan56
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Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:41 pm
Location: Nampa, Idaho

Re: Russian Cruiser Tech Tree

Postby Istvan56 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 11:14 pm

Tier VII
For Tier VII we see the tech tree merge as I only have 1 standard ship and 1 premium to propose.

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Project 68K Chapaev light cruiser, image courtesy of http://www.the-blueprints.com
Project 68 Chapaev-class Light Cruisers will be a favorite among players despite being classified as light they are no slackers in their combat capabilities. They are armed with twelve 152mm (6") guns, equal to USS Cleveland. They were started before WW-II but the war delayed their completion until 1950 when the Soviet Navy had discarded catapult planes and torpedo launchers in favor of helicopters and guided missiles. For the game we might seem them in Project 68 hulls as stock and then upgraded to the Project 68K hulls.
Type: Cruiser, since 1949 — light cruiser
Displacement: 11,130 long tons (11,310 t) standard, 14,100 long tons (14,300 t) full load
Length: 201 m (659 ft)
Beam: 19.7 m (65 ft)
Draught: 6.4 m (21 ft)
Propulsion: 2 shaft geared steam turbines, 6 boilers, 124,000 shp (92,000 kW)
Speed: 33.5 kn (62.0 km/h; 38.6 mph)
Range: 7,000 nmi (13,000 km; 8,100 mi) at 19 kn (35 km/h; 22 mph), 3,500 short tons (3,200 t) tons of oil fuel
Complement: 840
Armament: 12 × 152 mm (6.0 in)/57 cal B-38 in 4 triple Mk5-bis turrets,
8 × 100 mm (3.9 in)/56 cal Model 1934 in 4 twin SM-5-1 mounts
28 × 37 mm (1.5 in) AA
6 × 533 mm (21.0 in) torpedo tubes (later removed)
Armour: Belt: 100 mm (3.9 in)
Conning tower: 150 mm (5.9 in)
Deck: 50 mm
Turrets: 75 mm (3.0 in)
Aircraft carried: 2 seaplanes planned (later removed)
Aviation facilities: 1 catapult (later removed)


For the Tier VII premium ship I propose the Admiral Makarov, the ex-Nürnberg given to the USSR as war reparations. This Leipzig-class light cruiser would never overshadow the standard Chapaev light cruiser but would give players the chance to have this ship as a premium. The Admiral Makarov served as the flagship of the Soviet 8th Fleet based in Tallin until 1954 when she was replaced by one of the Chapaev light cruisers. She was then turned into a training ship until May 1959 and scrapped the next year along with nearly all of the pre-war cruisers.
Class and type: Leipzig-class cruiser
Displacement: 9,040 metric tons (8,900 long tons; 9,960 short tons)
Length: 181.3 m (595 ft)
Beam: 16.3 m (53 ft)
Draft: 5.74 m (18.8 ft)
Propulsion: Steam turbines and Diesels
3 shafts (Diesels on center shaft)
60,000 shp (45 MW) turbines + 12,400 hp (9.3 MW) diesels
Speed: 32 knots (59 km/h; 37 mph)
Range: 3,900 nautical miles (7,200 km) at 10 knots (19 km/h)
Complement: 25 officers
648 enlisted men
Sensors and
processing systems: FuMO 63 Hohentwiel
Armament: 9 × 15 cm SK C/25 guns
8 × 8.8 cm SK C/32 guns
8 × 3.7 cm SK C/30 guns
8 × 2 cm C/30 guns
12 × 53.3 cm (21.0 in) torpedo tubes
120 mines
Armor: Belt armor: 50 mm (2.0 in)
Deck: 30 mm (1.2 in)
Conning tower: 100 mm (3.9 in)
Aircraft carried: Arado 196 then possibly KOR-2
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Istvan56
ShipComrade Staff
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:41 pm
Location: Nampa, Idaho

Re: Russian Cruiser Tech Tree

Postby Istvan56 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 11:43 pm

Tier VIII
For Tier VIII I have 1 standard light cruiser and 1 premium heavy cruiser.

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Sverdlov-class light cruiser Admiral Lazarev (Адмирал Лазарев)
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Sverdlov-class light cruiser Admiral Ushakov (Адмирал Ушаков) as she was commissioned and then later as a possible guided missile cruiser. However, after the failures of the Dzerzhinsky (Дзержинский) that conversion was stopped.

The Project 68bis Sverdlov-class light cruisers were the last all gun cruisers built for the Soviet Navy. They were a well thought out design based upon Regia Marina pre-war ships. By keeping a light main armament they were very seaworthy and capable of escorting aircraft carriers or other capital ships. Originally they were conceived to accompany the larger Project 65 heavy cruisers and Project 66 battlecuisers but as those two projects were cancelled these became the mainstays of the Soviet Navy for decades. The last remaining member of this class, the Mikhail Kutuzov (Михаил Кутузов), is a museum ship in Novorossiysk. It is interesting that a Soviet ship was named after a royal prince but Prince Kutuzov, serving as a Field Marshal, is credited with saving Russia during the 1812 French Invasion making him a national hero.
Type: Light Cruiser
Displacement: 13,600 tons standard,
16,640 tons full load
Length: 210 m (689 ft 0 in) overall
205 m (672 ft 7 in) waterline
Beam: 22 m (72 ft 2 in)
Draught: 6.9 m (22 ft 8 in)
Installed power: 6 boilers, 118,100 hp (88,100 kW)
Propulsion: 2 shaft geared steam turbines
Speed: 32.5 knots (60.2 km/h; 37.4 mph)
Range: 9,000 nautical miles (17,000 km; 10,000 mi) at 18 knots (33 km/h; 21 mph)
Complement: 1,250
Armament:
12 x 152 mm (6 in)/57 cal B-38 guns in four triple Mk5-bis turrets
12 x 100 mm (3.9 in)/56 cal Model 1934 guns in 6 twin SM-5-1 mounts
32 x 37 mm (1.5 in) anti-aircraft guns
10 x 533 mm (21 in) torpedo tubes
Armour:
Belt: 100 mm (3.9 in)
Conning tower: 150 mm (5.9 in)
Deck: 50 mm (2.0 in)
Turrets: 175 mm (6.9 in)

For the Premium Heavy Cruiser I recommend the Project 83 Tallin ex-Petropavlovsk, ex-Lützow, a Hipper-class heavy cruiser as a completed ship. See my thread on the details of this ship which would differ from German cruisers due to her being finished by the Soviets. http://shipcomrade.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=391
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Istvan56
ShipComrade Staff
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:41 pm
Location: Nampa, Idaho

Re: Russian Cruiser Tech Tree

Postby Istvan56 » Fri Aug 07, 2015 1:05 am

Tier IX
For Tier IX and Tier X we have to resort to paper ships. Everything built after the Sverdlov-class are too modern for WoWs.

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Project 65 LKR in "light cruiser" guise with 152mm (6") guns

I knew little about the Project 65 until I ran across an article on Project 65 in MTC Bastion magazine by A.V. Karpenko, published on 4/19/2014. Even reading the Google Translation (I read English, some Spanish and Korean, not Russian) I was able to learn about this interesting ship design. In fact, it reminds me of the Mogami, having been first laid down as a Treaty light cruiser and then upgraded to a heavy cruiser. The Project 65 was proposed for the 1946-1955 ship building bienium in two guises, either as a light cruiser with nine 152mm (6") guns or with nine heavier 180mm (7.1") guns. Frankly, I could see both at Tier IX as hull-A and hull-B letting the player upgrade the ship. However, Stalin cancelled the project in 1951 favoring building more Project 68(bis) Sverdlov-class light cruisers and continuing the development of the Project 82 Stalingrad-class battlecruisers. Here are some of the statistics on this interesting paper ship:


Type: Light Cruiser (Draft Version 65V)
Displacement: 9480 standard, 11600 loaded
Length: 196.2 m
Beam: 17.7 m
Draught: 6.37 m
Propulsion: 2 shaft geared steam turbines, 4 boilers, 148,000 shp
Speed: 36.5 kn
Range: 4150 nmi at 18 kn
Complement: ?
Armament: 9 × 152 mm (6.0 in)/57 cal B-38 in 3 triple Mk5-bis turrets, 150 rounds per gun
8 × 100 mm (3.9 in)/56 cal Model 1934 in 4 twin SM-5-1 mounts, 250 rounds per gun
16 × 45 mm in quad AA mounts
24 x 25 mm in quad AA mounts
2 x 5 tube 533 mm (21") torpedoes
Armour: Belt: 70 mm
Conning tower: 70 mm
Deck: 50 mm main 16 mm top deck
Turrets: 70 mm front, side and roof
Citadel: 70-100 mm
Sensors: Search radars "Reef-A" "Gyuis-2" "Foot-N"
Main FDC radar: STS Zenith, KDP SPN-500
AA FDC radar: "Foot-B"
Jamming Station: "Coral"
Sonar: GAS "Pegasus"

The "Heavy Cruiser" version:
Type: Cruiser (Project Option III-A)
Displacement: 12960 standard, 15580 loaded
Length: 220 m
Beam: 19.7 m
Draught: 6.88 m
Propulsion: 2 shaft geared steam turbines, 4 boilers, 148,000 shp
Speed: 35.4 kn
Range: 5000 nmi at 18 kn
Complement: ?
Armament: 9 × 180 mm (7.1 in) 3 triple Mk5-bis turrets, 100 rounds per gun
12 × 100 mm (3.9 in)/56 cal Model 1934 in 6 twin SM-5-1 mounts, 200 rounds per gun
16 × 45 mm in quad AA mounts
16 x 25 mm in quad AA mounts
(Torpedo launchers removed for this version)
Armour: Belt: 100 mm
Conning tower: 70 mm
Deck: 50 mm main 20 mm top deck
Turrets: 175 mm front, 120 mm side and 80 mm roof
Citadel: 120 mm
Sensors: Search radars "Reef-A" "Gyuis-2" "Foot-N"
Main FDC radar: STS "Ocean-65", KDP SM-18
AA FDC radar: "Foot-B"
Jamming Station: "Coral"
Sonar: GAS "Pegasus"

Link: http://bastion-karpenko.ru/65/
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Istvan56
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Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:41 pm
Location: Nampa, Idaho

Re: Russian Cruiser Tech Tree

Postby Istvan56 » Fri Aug 07, 2015 2:00 am

Tier X

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There is a model of the Project 66 heavy cruiser in the naval museum in St. Petersburg. The reflection is "Valokuvat", a naval history buff from Finland and a valuable help in my looking for drawings of ships in the Russian Tech Tree. He has hosted many of them on his photobucket.com account.

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Project 66 was designed to fight the USN Des Moines-class cruisers

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Artist conception of the Project 66 TKR heavy cruiser
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Another view of the Project 66 model
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Project 66 TKR heavy cruiser line drawing

At the end of WW-II saw the victors staring across new borders at each other. The Cold War had begun and for the Soviet Navy the news was grim. All of their plans for new aircraft carriers had been cancelled during the war and no new capital ships were laid down. Even their cruiser fleet was growing obsolete and compared the to the US Navy, their likely new enemy, they didn't stand a chance. The US Navy had 75 cruisers alone in 1945 and the newest ones, the Alaska-class and the Des Moines-class had armor that could withstand the largest shells of the Soviet cruisers then in service. Even with the addition of foreign reparation ships the Soviet Navy didn't have enough ships and so a new plan, the 1946-1955 bienium ship building plan was developed. The Navy wanted Project 66, a 220 mm (9") armed heavy cruiser but Stalin wanted a bigger, faster cruiser even if he had to sacrifice armor for speed, and he got his wish with Project 82 Stalingrad-class battlecruiser. Eventually reason took hold and Project 82 was cancelled along with the idea that gun cruisers were necessary. Already guided missiles were becoming the wave of the future as they could out-range any main gun ever built.
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The Project 66 technical draft required the following features:
Displacement: 30750 t loaded
Length: 252.5 m
Beam: 31.6 m
Draft: 9 m
Speed: 32.5 knots
Armour:
Belt: 155 mm
Deck: 135 - 170 mm
Main Armament: 3 x triple 220 mm (9")/65 caliber guns
Ammuntion: 176 kg. shell
Muzzle Velocity: 985 m/s
Max. Range: 260 cables (48.1 km)
Rate of Fire: 3-5 rounds per minute
Secondary Guns: 4 x twin 130 mm/54 caliber guns
AA Guns: 6 x quad 45 mm, 6 x quad 25 mm

Source: http://www.navycollection.narod.ru/ships/Russia/Cruisers/TKR_Proect_66/history.html
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Istvan56
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Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:41 pm
Location: Nampa, Idaho

Re: Russian Cruiser Tech Tree

Postby Istvan56 » Wed Dec 30, 2015 3:53 pm

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Well, the RU Server has the premium Tier VIII light cruiser Mikhail Kutuzov (Михаил Кутузов) on sale as a New Year special. This set it at Tier VIII as I predicted and I should've expected that a museum ship would be a premium. It has excellent AA though there has been a decline in the number of CV's in game as of late. With twelve 6" guns it can hold its own against the Mogami with its fifteen 6" guns in light cruiser guise and is superior to the Cleveland in all regards, as it should be at Tier VIII.
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